ADMIRAL_LORD_WEST DR_MARTHA_NEWSON INTERVIEWER JEANETTE_WINTERSON JJ_CHALMERS MARJORIE NADIFA_MOHAMED PROF_SUZANNAH JJ CHALMERS With five compartments flooded, the Titanic is going to sink. They have around an hour and a half until it�s going to disappear below the waves. They�re never going to get all the water out of the ship but can they hold it back just a little bit longer in order to save everybody on board? JJ CHALMERS Once you begin to understand that you are really up against it in terms of time it goes from we can�t save the ship but can we get the passengers from the Titanic to a rescue ship before the Titanic sinks. The captain knows that the decisions that are made in the coming minutes, hours � ultimately that will be the decider on how many people will make it off of the ship alive. JJ CHALMERS The reality is for the crew on the Titanic at this moment they have no idea what level of catastrophe they�re in, they just know they have a job to do. DR MARTHA NEWSON The captain doesn�t share the information he has with all the officers that the ship isn�t going down, and precisely why he hasn�t shared it remains a mystery. It may be a strategy, he doesn�t want them to panic. Maybe it reflects an internal chaos. He doesn�t know who to tell or when. DR MARTHA NEWSON At that point in time the general public weren�t really trusted. Keeping people in ignorance was considered better and we know that today that actually people will respond much more sensibly in an emergency if they do have some information. That information was completely lacking at this point on Titanic. INTERVIEWER In a great emergency like that where there were limited facilities, could you not have put more people into boats? INTERVIEWER You did not know it was urgent? DR MARTHA NEWSON Lightoller wants to do a good job, clearly. Maybe if he�d known the ship was sinking he would have allowed men in to fill up the spaces in the lifeboats, but because the Captain was withholding information people like Lightoller can�t do their job properly and this will have disastrous consequences. JJ CHALMERS The crew of The Titanic have to think on their feet so they start to use Morse lamps and send a signal using light rather than sound. NADIFA MOHAMED Can you imagine the chaos and the fear and the terror of finding water in your cabin and you�re in the bowels of the ship.It makes me panic just thinking about it. In a crisis you just have to increase your chances of survival. Survival is all about probability, you know, throwing as much muck at the wall as possible and seeing what sticks. DR MARTHA NEWSON It might be that Lightoller has this kind of rigid view of the world, he�s come in with this set of rules, it might be that under this stressful situation it�s the only way he can function. He can�t cope with more information and more decision-making so he just sicks to this one option. JJ CHALMERS The dilemma is that you just have to accept in that moment those are�.yeah those are heavy. INTERVIEWER From what you have said, you discriminated entirely in the interest of the women and children in filling those lifeboats. INTERVIEWER Why did you do that? Because of the Captain�s orders or because of the rule of the sea? PROF SUZANNAH The story of the Titanic is the human condition spread out, pinned on a board for us to examine. JJ CHALMERS It�s these small decisions, these little butterfly effect moments that change the outcome. PROF SUZANNAH There are 2208 passengers on board. They wont all fit on the life boats so the life boats will have to do shuttle runs. Take passengers to the rescue ship, come back and then take the next lot of passengers. It�s physically possible for them to save all the passengers but they have to do it in an orderly fashion, and the people who are going to go first are those whose rooms are closest to the boat deck and those are the first class passengers. In this emergency plan the wealthy and the powerful have an innate advantage � they are top of the list.All of the order has been lost. MARJORIE I called out, Don�t shoot JEANETTE WINTERSON Right now on the Titanic there�s a red alert emergency. Down below in the boiler room all the crew, the firemen that would normally be down there have been called back on shift to try to pull out the water that is flooding into the compartment. Imagine there�s steam everywhere. There�s the groaning, creaking splitting sounds of the ship itself. It�s terrifying. They are like soldiers going into battle ADMIRAL LORD WEST What I think is unfortunate in Titanic is that the captain had not established a mechanism whereby he was getting information about what the actual damage was in various parts of the ship. This is something that there should have been being worked on much earlier. As a result, time was lost. JEANETTE WINTERSON So, in the radio room right now it�s a race against time. The operators must send out the distress signal, it�s the standard Morse Code signal that will tell shipping in the area that the Titanic is in trouble and needs help. These two young men, they�re in their twenties and now responsible for seeking rescue for the unsinkable ship, Titanic. JEANETTE WINTERSON We�re not gonna see hysteria, we�re not even gonna see anxiety at this point, not least because the information is distorted and fragmented. Nobody is thinking that the ship is going to sink, only Captain Smith really knows the extent of what is happening. PROF SUZANNAH Violet Jessop is a first class stewardess, she�s 24 years old, she�s the youngest stewardess on board. The first class stewards and stewardesses really are the ones who are responsible for making this evacuation process happen. They have to demonstrate extraordinary self-control and put these other people first. PROF SUZANNAH The first class passengers have invested financially, they�ve spent a lot on their tickets. They�ve invested psychologically in this being safe and luxurious, and they therefore cannot believe that it can be anything but that. It�s such a loop of imagination to go against everything they�ve internalized about this experience and start to believe that something might be going wrong. PROF SUZANNAH Lucy, Lady Duff-Gordon is one of the most prominent people on board. After divorcing her previous husband she managed to build up her business which is a fashion design house into a multimillion pound enterprise, and this is a time when many women don�t even have bank accounts, so she�s obviously extraordinary, she�s very resourceful and that will come to be important. JEANETTE WINTERSON So, Boxhall can see the nearest ship to the Titanic which is The Californian, she�s very close by, about 14 miles. Big Californian had already communicated with the Titanic earlier that evening, that she was going to spend the night in the ice flow because it was too dangerous to continue but The Californian would be able to reach Titanic before she sinks. JEANETTE WINTERSON Californian isn�t picking up any signals. The radio operator has gone to bed, not because he�s negligent but because he�s allowed to go to bed, there�s no duty to stay in the radio room all night and many ships did not ask this of their operators. But then suddenly a chance message comes in from a wireless operator on another ship, The Carpathia. Harold Cottam, Wireless Operator, RMS Carpathia I was about to retire. I�d taken my coat off. I should have bene turning in in about 10 minutes. I called The Titanic. And its only answer was � Struck a berg. Come at once. JEANETTE WINTERSON The Carpathia is a transatlantic steamship, she�s fast but she�s going in the other direction. Jack Phillips hears that the radio operator is going to tell the Captain that Titanic is in trouble. The Captain of the Carpathia will then make the decision about what to do, and that usually means to turn your vessel towards the ship that is in distress. That�s the rule of the sea. So, here is a chance of rescue. As long as Carpathia is able to get there in time. JEANETTE WINTERSON People don�t want to get in. Why would you want to get out of your warm bed and go in a lifeboat into the freezing water when there�s no problem? You wouldn�t. This is like a really annoying fire drill at school and everybody says no, I�ll just stay here until it�s finished. PROF SUZANNAH So, Captain Smith has ordered that women and children should be evacuated and they should be prioritized. On the portside the second officer, Officer Lightoller interprets it as women and children only. The consequence of this is that if you are a family turning up on the portside you will be separated and the men will not be allowed on the lifeboats. Saving the lives of women and children comes from deep in the Edwardian mindset.Women at the time are seen as having a kind of childish status, I mean this is before they�ve bene allowed to vote. And they are perceived to have a physical and mental weakness that means that men have to be their protectors. PROF SUZANNAH Every time Officer Lightoller prevents a man from getting into a lifeboat there is the possibility that his wife won�t go, that they will stay on board the ship. So, he�s actually potentially endangering the lives of the precise people he�s being told to prioritise to save. ADMIRAL LORD WEST What one wants is to have a very good relationship, a band of brothers. When you�ve got that you must keep them informed of what�s going on, and what we call nowadays Mission Command, in other words, you let them know what you want to achieve overall and you tell them al the facts and then you let them get on with it. I think that Captain Smith was overwhelmed by the enormity of what was happening and was not really grasping it and taking charge. JEANETTE WINTERSON Imagine the relief in the radio room, Carpathia has answered the distress call, is coming their way, but although she�s going as fast as she can, she�s having to go through the same ice field where Titanic has floundered. She�s four hours away and Titanic isn�t going to stay afloat that long. The nearest ship to Titanic is The California but the radio operator is still asleep, nobody is aware of any problem on the Titanic. JEANETTE WINTERSON Right now the water is rising up through the body of the ship. ADMIRAL LORD WEST The water with bulkheads only went up to a certain level. By this stage, water was tipping over bulkheads and cascading into the next compartment. So, compartment after compartmentwas being filled by water. JEANETTE WINTERSON And as this mass of water breaches the bulkheads it starts flowing back on itself making cascades and waterfalls coming down the narrow staircases. NADIFA MOHAMED Third class passengers in the bowels of the ship are at most risk. They were really left in the dark. They are wading through water, they�re not aware of what�s going on, the rescue mission going on in the upper decks. They had to work it out themselves. NADIFA MOHAMED Celiney is from Hardin which was in Lebanon and she is a newly wed bride, and her older husband is taking her to live with him in America. They are caught between going up to the higher decks and the desire to keep their belongings. It�s easy to underestimate just how important things are to a migrant, to someone who�s leaving home forever. Do you want to arrive in New York destitute with nothing to your name, nothing to pay for a room? Of course not. JEANETTE WINTERSON Depending where you are in the ship right now, you�re going to start seeing a lot of water. The third class passengers in particular. Water in any quantity is terrifying because you cant push it away, you can�t fight it. People are now seeing evidence with their own eyes, it�s not rumour, it�s not gossip, it�s not even that they�re waiting to be told, they can see, feel that there is a problem. NADIFA MOHAMED Charlotte Collyer is a second class passenger, she�s travelling with her husband, Harvey and her eight year old daughter, Marjorie. Charlotte has health issues, she has tuberculosis so she�s eager to find a new climate for herself as well as whatever economic benefit they might get from migrating. PROF SUZANNAH Whilst this whole hour has passed in which the first class passengers are being evacuated they were told to stay in their cabin. They are sitting there and worrying and no one is telling them anything. DR MARTHA NEWSON For anyone that was feeling confused or was just following the rules it�s very clear something major is now happening. It�s going to be terrifying, especially if you�re a parent with a young child. JEANETTE WINTERSON Nobody is telling anybody what�s going on. The Captain knows, a few of the officers know but it�s important to keep this away because of panic. But now because of the noise, the tilt people are realizing that something is wrong. JEANETTE WINTERSON A huge wave of green water comes flying through into the room because the coal bunker has been gradually filling up and filling up and filling up with the pressure. And then it bursts and suddenly it�s all over them. Another engineer, Jonathan Shepherd has already slipped and broken his leg so he can�t escape this wall of water. And he�s the first casualty to die on The Titanic. JEANETTE WINTERSON Now that boiler room 5 is filled with water, the engineers realise that all their efforts are futile, there�s no point pumping it out anymore, it�s coming in faster than anyone can manage it. This is a moment of terror and certainty. Perhaps this is the first moment where these brave men realise that the ship is going to go down. NADIFA MOHAMED One of the pivotal facts about unloading of the lightboats is this, there are different protocols on each side of the ship. On the starboard side Officer Murdoch�s approach is more pragmatic,it�s more flexible. PROF SUZANNAH If you emerge on the starboard side then Officer Murdoch might well allow the men to join the women and their children if there are spaces left JEANETTE WINTERSON So, there�s Murdoch allowing men to fill up the spare places, why not? Murdoch doesn�t want to split families up. NADIFA MOHAMED Murdoch I think probably had a sense of wanting to preserve life. And Lightoller had a stricter, more patriarchal view perhaps of men should sacrifice themselves for women and children but the fact that it was happening on the same ship at the same time shows just how vague this policy was. PROF SUZANNAH So, it matters very much which side of the ship you�re on if you�re a man. JEANETTE WINTERSON We�ll never know why there was miscommunication between The Californian and Titanic. There seems to be some confusion about the colour of these rockets, were they distress signals. It�s also possible that Boxhall didn�t see Californian�s Morse lamp reply because there�s something strange about the atmospheric conditions that night. You�ve got this weird effect of warm air underneath and colder air on top, which is creating a kind of mirage effect. Shapes are being distorted in the darkness. JEANETTE WINTERSON This must be the bitterest blow for those people who could see the ship nearby. I don�t think it was bad favour,I don�t think it was negligence, I think everything conspired that night to go against Titanic�s chances of safety and salvation. PROF SUZANNAH Because the early lifeboats went out half full there were now only about 900 places left on the lifeboats, and more than 2000 people on board the ship. If people don�t get onto a lifeboat they will go down with the Titanic. PROF SUZANNAH Lucy Duff-Gordon knows that she needs to get off the ship. This is the moment to take one of those spaces. NADIFA MOHAMED There is something here about being in the right place at the right time but also seizing the opportunity and having the confidence to do so. I think that class probably had a huge impact on people�s sense of entitlement to safety, to rescue. You probably did assume that if you bought a first class ticket then that would buy you survival. They are people who are important in the world, they see themselves as having more value than people in steerage, and there they are as a couple sitting safely in a lifeboat. NADIFA MOHAMED Charlotte knows she�ll be separated from her husband, not knowing if and when they�d be reunited I think she probably was just thinking please, no not this, I want to survive but not at this cost. JEANETTE WINTERSON Officer Lightoller, the man�s been at sea since he was thirteen, he doesn�t have that understanding of what it means when awoman is clinging to her husband, when a child is crying for her father, he just goes ahead with what he believes to be right but it�s not objectively right. NADIFA MOHAMED Port or starboard, that sliding doors moment will determine who survives and who doesn�t. NADIFA MOHAMED There�s a really stark disadvantage facing the third class passengers. JEANETTE WINTERSON Chekov said you can�t put a gun in the room and not use it.